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Interview: Gibson Says New Film Not Overly Violent

Filmmaker Talks Film's Violence, Iraq War, Spiritual Elements

POSTED: 10:00 pm CST December 14, 2006

If Hollywood was a track and field competition, then it's clear that actor-filmmaker Mel Gibson would be best suited for the hurdles.

Sometimes Gibson manages to take amazing leaps over controversy to score box office gold with films like "The Passion of the Christ." Sometimes he trips and falls on his face, with highly publicized incidents like his anti-Semitic outburst during his arrest on suspicion of drunken driving in July.

Public humiliation notwithstanding, Gibson is not about to let his personal mistakes affect his professional career, which explains why he's hit the ground running to take another huge leap of faith with his new dramatic action-adventure "Apocalypto."

With a No. 1 opening last weekend and a $15 million box office take, it initially appears that Gibson has cleared another hurdle in his storied career, despite obstacles. One is that, like "The Passion of the Christ," "Apocalypto's" dialogue is spoken in a foreign dialect with English subtitles. Another is, unlike his biblical epic, "Apocalypto" doesn't have a built-in audience.

Or does it?

Thanks to Gibson's storytelling prowess, there's nothing that really can get lost in the translation with his new film. He establishes the characters as people we can relate to -- people who play practical jokes and complain about things like mother-in-laws' woes -- and not some staunch period piece characters incapable of emotion.

"If you can't access your characters from the get-go, you won't be involved in their journey -- so you have to relate to them in some way," Gibson told me in an @ The Movies interview this week. "The best way to relate to them is laughter, and if you're going to laugh with someone, you're going to cry with them."

And that "relatable" factor is part of the reason Gibson feels that there's an outcry by critics over "Apocalypto's" brutality.

Tim Lammers
"It's not that it's overly violent. It's less violent than 'Braveheart,''" said Gibson, referencing his 1995 Best Picture Oscar winner. "I think that people are invested so much in the characters it seems more upsetting if they even get a hangnail."

A pre-Central America period epic about the crumbling of a once great Mayan civilization, "Apocalypto" is largely made up of a cast of non-actors. Filmed in the rain forests of Mexico, the film is a mythic tale about Jaguar Paw (Rudy Youngblood), whose peaceful village is ravaged by invading forces that rule by fear and oppression.

Escaping a fate of human sacrifice by Mayan leaders to "pay" for the famine that's dilapidating the region, Jaguar Paw finds himself in a race against time to save his pregnant wife (Dalia Hernandez) and child left behind in his village, who face certain death.

Weathering Criticism Of Violence
Of course, this isn't the first time Gibson has been bloodied by critics over the violence in his films. The filmmaker was savaged by reviewers for his graphic depiction of Jesus' crucifixion in "The Passion of the Christ" (which was compounded by charges by Jewish leaders that he was drumming up anti-Semitic sentiments), and many critics of "Apocalypto" are using the word "sadistic" to describe Gibson in their film reviews.

At issue with many critics are the scenes of human sacrifice atop a Maya City pyramid, where victims are decapitated -- a merciful act, considering that they had their hearts ripped out of their chests by the high priest before the final blow.

Gibson said he can weather the negative reviews and slams about the violence, as long as the critic who's doling out the jabs is sincere.

"You can't take (reviews) seriously. You don't take the good ones as florid as they are, and you don't take the bad ones for as bad as they get," Gibson said. "There are honest critics and there are disingenuous ones. There are some people who have axes to grind and there are some people who don't give a hoot but they're being as honest as they can. They can be negative, too, but you know the difference, when you read them. It's transparent to me. I've been in this game a long time and I know when I'm being knifed."

One thing Gibson isn't sure of is whether he's the victim of double standards. It's not as if he doesn't have the capability to understand if he's being treated unfairly: He just doesn't care to understand it.

For example, I asked him whether he's being raked over for the violence in the film while no one seems to complain that filmmakers like Martin Scorsese deliver equally violent films, like "The Departed."

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Mel Gibson on the set of "Apocalypto"
"I don't really muse on these things too much," Gibson said. "I just make compelling stories, and if they survive the slings and arrows of outrageous fortune, then it was worth doing. I think the audience -- the man in the seat -- they know what they're seeing. You're right, there seems to be exceptions ... for some people and other people get tarred and feathered. That's not my concern. If I bear resentment or grudges over stuff, I'm not doing what I'm supposed to do."

Accept it or loathe it, Gibson's glad that the violence in "Apocalypto" is something that can generate a dialogue, which isn't necessarily a bad thing.

"At the heart of this of this story I think you are dealing with a culture that is violent, and I don't think the level of violence is inappropriate. In fact, I've been merciful to you sometimes," Gibson said. "I wasn't in on some stuff. I stayed way back. I could have gone there but I didn't. I didn't choose to. But as I say, it's all to do with character and story. It's a love story."

Iraq War Parallels
If the salvos by critics aren't enough, Gibson has upset some Republicans over his observation that "Apocalypto" is an allegory for the war in Iraq in that the crisis in the film is propagated by fear.

"Some people, I guess, didn't like hearing that, but I have an opinion about things," Gibson said. "I still have to be furnished with a reason why there's a war over there with our troops. I mean, it's our young men and women. I would never denigrate soldiers. I think that they are heroes. I question the validity of the purpose."

Gibson called the situation "a big shell and pea game" where a reason for going there can't be pinpointed. He asked, "Was it for weapons of mass destruction?" or something else?

"It goes round and round, so I question it -- and we should question it, damn it," Gibson said firmly. "Our young people are dying over there, and for what? What is the real reason?"

By coming out against the war, Gibson effectively clears up the misconception that he's a member of the Republican Party. It's been a presumption by many because of his deep religious convictions. But truth be told, Gibson said he's always been an Independent.

"I just look at things and try and make a judgment on them without being swayed or color of 'a party.' I don't want to be a member of a party," Gibson explained. "I want to look at things as right or good. And boy, in this world, nothing's perfect. Even the greatest presidencies we've had in this country, I'm sure they've had their own flaws. We're all flawed and the system is flawed."

The best we can do, Gibson added, is to "try your level best" and don't lose hope.

"I'm not saying that there's no hope -- I'm not the prophet of doom and gloom. I think there's a lot of hope," Gibson said, again referencing the Iraq war. "I'm just questioning (it), that's all, because it needs to be asked. I think a lot of people are not happy with the situation."

A Different Kind Of Passion
There's no question that "Apocalypto" has far less, if anything, to do with religion than "The Passion of the Christ" did. But that's not to say that Gibson's faith isn't reflected in some way in the narrative.

Gibson pointed out one scene -- where Jaguar Paw's father gives him advice about fear being a disease -- as one of having elements of spirituality.

Touchstone Image
Rudy Youngblood in "Apocalypto"
"Fears do afflict us all, and it's easy to be driven by them," Gibson said. "That's sound advice in any era, I think ? you almost have to be spiritual to overcome real fears. That's a vary of the flesh and of the mind and the heart. They afflict the same areas that the spirit should, so they have to be dispelled or fired out with spirituality. And then virtues come (like) courage and all the things that I'm in need of. That's what the mythic stories are all about. They're about teaching."

And in "Apocalypto," Gibson said the lesson learned is that "there's no such thing as a hopeless situation." For Jaguar Paw, it's about avoiding human sacrifice in Maya City and outwitting bloodthirsty warriors on his arduous journey home through the forests to save his family.

"When it looks really bleak, he has a moment of clarity and he says, 'No, I'm not going anywhere. I can't go. I have a family in a hole some place and I'm going back to get them,'" Gibson said. "When it's really grim, he gets spared and then it gets out of the frying pan and into the fire. He has to overcome all these trials -- he's driven by the love for culture, his family and his environment -- to get back and to triumph in the surmounting fear and evil."

Hear the complete Mel Gibson interview by clicking the podcast link above.



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